On dirait que quelqu’un avec une vue d’ensemble de l’équipe aurait dû s’occuper de cela, comme cela fonctionne avec la plupart des autres équipes.
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Virtual_Bug_723
@Maple Leafs de Toronto
On dirait que quelqu’un avec une vue d’ensemble de l’équipe aurait dû s’occuper de cela, comme cela fonctionne avec la plupart des autres équipes.
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Virtual_Bug_723
33 Comments
Attempting to « emulate the Florida Panthers » without seemingly understanding what they do well is just great.
Great fanfare?
The thing is nobody has ever been empowered to touch the core. Even Marner is only gone today because he eventually left on his own accord. That « roster control » is just moving deck chairs on the Titanic.
Berube is staying for next season, isn’t he ugh
I don’t think it’s that crazy that a coach would ask and prefer certain type of players.
But it’s on the GM to find that type of player that’s actually good and can contribute positively to the team which Treliving has failed at.
Name a GM that wouldn’t talk to the coach about players and needs and construction
Tre and Berube obviously felt the same way about the roster and moved in that direction.
Right or wrong…. This comment is a nothing burger. Every coach has influence on their gms. You think cooper doesn’t sit in on those conversations
I’m not sure Bérubé really had “control” over much, they more or less had him give input into the decisions on what type of players would fit his coaching style.
Bérubé wanted them to play strong, gritty, dump and chase hockey, but the leafs were undersized and not equipped for that, so they brought in a bunch of big dudes. I don’t think it’s any more than that.
They just chose the wrong dudes. They are too slow to chase pucks, and the rest of the team never tried to really buy into the system and it torpedoed everything.
I always thought it was more Keith Pelley who wanted Berube to have a ton of influence on everything, based on how he was gushing over him.
Hindsight 20/20, but this entire sub was creaming their pants when Berube initially said it would be an honor to coach the Leafs and after his first presser as coach, we fell for him even more.
The flaws were glaring, but we had statistically the best Goaltending season in recent feanchise history masking almost all those problems and Treliving basically doubled down on it at the deadline.
To play panther style hockey you need panther style players and panther style blind eyes from officiating and the league
The article says influence but OP says control.
How did they think a dump and chase was going to work with the way our defence was made, they can’t skate and they can’t provide quality shots.
Why do we do things no other team does !? Then they wonder why they suck
Treliving seems like a wet paper towel with 0 leadership skills
People don’t realize that Floridas style works with all star goal tending.
There is a reason they just sneaked into the playoffs in 2023. No one remembers because the leafs lost but the panthers didn’t have this identity when they snuck in to the playoffs in 2023. The games were much closer than people remembered and the Leafs got around 50 shots most games that playoff series.
Edmonton game back from 3-0 when Bob started playing poorly. And Florida won game 7 as Bob showed back up.
The Leafs almost went up 3-0 last year on Florida but didn’t because of an OT loss. Then Bob showed up. Game 4 was a goaltending duel. Game 6, Will got a shut out. And we all know how game 7 went.
My point is that playoff Florida is a mighty impressive forecheck. But they do give up odd man rushes still. The only time it doesn’t is when Floridas game is perfected and they keep you pinned in your zone.
Berube, wants everyone to be the 2019 Blues. Which was a failure under Mike Yeo. It was an utter Goldie locks situation.
Keefe was a regular season stud with this roster. And look, he’s shit with a relented roster in New Jersey.
Regarding Keefe: Both can be true in that he was handcuffed from making decisions that he wanted to because Dubas was also handcuffed, while at the same time, he did make mistakes on the things that he did control. I liked Keefe and wish they kept him, I also think he was a fall guy for much broader issues. However, even I’ll admit that he wasn’t perfect, made roster choices that didn’t work at all and kept players in roles that they weren’t made for.
Regarding trying to emulate the Panthers or Lightning. It’s impossible to emulate those teams and find the same success if you’re using the Alibaba version of their players and coaching. Both Paul Maurice and Jon Cooper are future HOF coaches and as others have said, teams like Florida had absolute dogs on their roster that made up for any skill issues with heart and passion. Something we’ve always lacked.
Would people be accepting of Sheldon Keefe being back? I doubt it’ll happen, but with the year Jersey is having, it seems like he might be fired too.
It’s probably not going to happen but I don’t hate the idea. Matthews was an all-time great goal scorer under him.
THIS TEAM NEEDS TRUCULANCE 🤦♂️
Textbook definition of poor corpo management right here.
Just cause something worked for someone/org, doesn’t guarantee it’ll work for you if you don’t have the same culture, DNA, and fringe benefits.
Well protecting the net front ain’t doin us much help is it Craig?
The Leafs are so ridiculously bad at dump and chase. They are just too damn slow to get on loose pucks.
Many people were happy with the Berube signing, I was one of them. Time to change coaches though and roster construction.
Do I have the answers, nope….does anyone, probably not…..
Go leafs go! Hopefully they will win one day
Honest answer – most coaches have some level of roster control similar to this.
Almost every single successful organization has a synergy between Coach, GM, and POHO.
And to be completely fair, Treliving and Berube did seem to be on the same page last year.
I guess it’s theoretically not a bad thing to have GM and coach on the same page. That being said, what’s the conclusion here? Either they agreed on a type of player and Tre didn’t deliver, or they got the player and Bérubé still couldn’t use them properly.
Regardless of which one is true, it seems like getting severely outshot and out possessed and over relying on elite goaltending is not a good strategy. Mix that in which forcing all your players to block a million shots and then shit on them for not showing drive or effort. Probably not great for morale.
I sure hope the main issue here is coaching, because if the next guy doesn’t get a bump out of this group, then our only option will be to blow it up, and I’m afraid that the higher ups will once again be too slow to make a decision.
John Brophy 2.0 Eerily similar with some upgrades. Berube NHL v ECHL career, Roy for Marner v Kordic for Courtnall. Seriously though, wrong coach for this particular team maybe Treliving felt if things didn’t work out Berube would get to own it all and if it did work out he could take partial credit.
>> Why did Treliving (insert any dumb action as GM)?
Because he is a shitty GM; I thought that was pretty obvious by now…
I think what’s missing from the discussion is that Berube’s system is garbage for this team. He’s trying to make the square peg fit in the circle hole. Treliving is then acquiring tools that cannot be used in that system.
Getting bigger with less finesse is exactly what this team needed – they were getting bullied in the playoffs and their finesse players were getting shut down. But it needed to be with a system that still makes best use of their best talent and is, most importantly, unpredictable. The current system has neutered our best guys and was too easy to shut down.
One thing that teams like Florida did really well, is they played extremely unpredictably. One shift you’d be getting your face slammed into the glass and your goalie would be getting run over the next, then you’d be getting finessed by controlled dump ins where the defence would be afraid of getting squashed and make a bad play.
Keefe actually did really well running a system that was run and gun, he just really needed some heat seeking missiles in the lineup to balance it out and be more unpredictable. The Leafs are the easiest team to play against and shut down now.
Brad seems to have these excuses that follow him everywhere.
When he was in Calgary, he couldn’t put together a good team because « the owner was too involved. » In Toronto, he can’t do his job because « the head coach he hired has more power than Brad. »
Seems like convenient excuses for doing a very poor job. Craig Berube got a 3rd for Scott Laughton after trading a 1st? Berube failed to trade OEL after sitting him out?
It’s Brad. It’s always Brad. It was Brad in Calgary, and it’s Brad in Toronto.
The panthers “style” was having the deepest roster in the nhl and somehow winning like 5 trades in a row spectacularly
I thought it was arranged as an unusual GM/Coach relationship where Pelley wanted them to work together more than Brad being the overseer of all things.
What i mean is Brad has more power than Berube but they are a tandem in regards to how the roster is managed and Pelley oversees all decisions.
Idk hard to explain but when they were hired I remember Keith Pelley introduction interview where he explained how he saw it was going to run. Iirc all three were sitting in front of the media.
And I remember thinking that’s wierd. Like Brad has to consult Berube about the additions before he just acquires a player or something.
As much as the deep thinkers here will trash Berube for this approach with this team, this is precisely the style of play that wins Cups. It was a good idea to move in this direction, given the yearly failures in the playoffs.
I’m no fan of Berube. I didn’t agree with the hiring at the time. It wasn’t so much that he wasn’t a fit for the floating shit style that resulted in the Leafs winning a couple of playoff rounds in the past decade. It’s that I didn’t think he was a good coach overall. Workmanlike player and coach who lucked out with the Blues and won a fluke Cup off Binnington. He was never going to be the answer in Toronto.
That said, the Leafs need a roster led by players who commit. Skill only goes so far. You still need effort and commitment to a smart, tough system. That’s what wins.
Only one coach has ever one more than one Stanley Cup with more than one team. Ever.
Dump and chase? More like dumb and chaste.